00:01We have some…a couple of closing thoughts.

00:03First, I want to say thank you all for coming and spending the time that you did.

00:09Do you think this was a good conference? [Applause] It was very good.

00:13I think so too. Yep. I want to thank all of the organizers for this.

00:19I have a couple of simple words and then some thoughts about what do we do next.

00:24The simple words are, this is an interesting community that's starting to emerge.

00:29That's what I would call it. I'm not sure if it's a profession or a trend or…I don’t exactly know how we'd characterize it.

00:36But the big goal for me that is coming into being is that there's a community that's being established…

00:43…of friends and colleagues around the world that know at least about…something about geodesign.

00:50And that's going to continue on, I think. Don't you think it'll continue on?

00:54I mean, we have some books coming out, we have papers, we have colleagues…

00:59…we have new thinking, we have real projects under way, and I think that's very healthy.

01:07The question I have is what about next…what do we do next to really accelerate this or move this or…

01:15…drive it in the direction that you want to do? And I don't have exactly an answer.

01:20The first question, that is very practical, is, should we do this again next year, and if so, where?

01:27So how many of you would come to this next year, if we did it again?

01:34And then, where should we do it? We have three proposals…

01:39…repeat it again here, do it in Minnesota, or do it in the Boston region.

01:44These are all suggestions that are valid, so let's go down the block. Think for a moment. Where do you want to do it?

01:54[Inaudible audience comment]

01:55Oh, I see. He said, It depends upon what season.

02:00[Inaudible audience comments]

02:04Or Cambridge. So January's a bad time? Is January a bad time for it? Yes…No.

02:13[Inaudible audience comment]

02:14But only here. Right.

02:19So who would like to do it in Boston next year?

02:23Who would like to do it in Minnesota next year? Okay, so we got three. Are you guys from Minnesota?

02:33Who would like to do it here again next year? Okay. Well, if it's okay, we'll just do it again here.

02:42We will sponsor it again. We'll do it according to the same sort of format. If it's okay with you guys, we'll do that.

02:51Then I think what I'd like to do next is something that's a little less practical…

02:56…is have Carl and Tom and perhaps you, Steve, and some others…

03:01…talk openly about what do we do next with respect to the agenda of pushing this along.

03:08I mean, we have an agenda of pushing it along in private practice, we have an agenda of pushing it along in academia…

03:19…with curriculum and programs, we have an agenda of pushing it along in the research community…

03:26…we have agendas about pushing it along with enabling technologies, tool building…

03:32…building on some of the stuff that Steve had…

03:36…these are all thoughts that occur in my mind about what do we do next. And there's probably others.

03:42So…how many of you want to push these agendas along? Let me just ask that.

03:48How many of you think this is not worthwhile? Okay. Well. Let's talk about those four.

03:57And Carl, you want to start off with the research agenda?

04:02Is this on? I'm a little older and less patient, and to me…and a little bit perhaps hard-headed…but my priorities are two.

04:21One, I'm less interested in the professionals…

04:24…because you think you know what you're doing, and you're doing it, and you're getting paid…

04:27…and keep doing it. I'm interested in the next generation.

04:32And therefore I'm interested first and foremost in what's the educational structure.

04:37How do you organize it? Is it a cartel, is it a competition, is it a chaos? I don't want 50 years of experimentation…

04:47…before you figure out what you're doing. I want 2 years of experimentation before you figure out what you're doing…

04:55…and then I want diversity, but not too much.

04:58So one of my priorities would be, Jack has given, or the company has given, support to let's say, a hundred universities…

05:08…I don't know what the number is. Maybe five hundred around the world. That e-mail goes to every dean…

05:14…the dean is told, get somebody here from your university, and the deans have a cartel meeting…

05:20…and they decide whether they're going to compete, and if so how, and you make your deals on the second day. Okay.

05:26And there're variations of those. You run it like the United Kingdom runs competitions for seed money.

05:32You put a hundred people in the room, and they negotiate with each other, and different plans come out…

05:38…and you fund the ones that you think are interesting, and you don't fund the ones that are not…

05:43…and a group of people makes that decision. It's basically like those business television programs.

05:48And you got 48 hours to make the deal. Period. So that's one of my priorities.

05:53The second priority relates to that, but I really think that we don't know that much about what we're doing.

06:02Let me give you some examples that various of the presentations brought up…

06:08…but in a way that you might not find that happy.

06:12Supposing that you have a group of people at a university or across universities…

06:18…some of which are very capable of working at one scale…

06:22…and they need the help of somebody who's very capable, but who works at another scale.

06:29What are the methods by which design can be done at several scales simultaneously? Not serially but simultaneously?

06:38And what are the methods of design that have to be invented?

06:42And I've had…we know very little about that. We have no case studies, we have no observational work…

06:48…and I think there's actually fundamental research that has to be done.

06:53So I would say my second priority is, Let's figure out what the questions are…

06:57…and let's figure out how to organize to do the fundamental research, some of which might involve practice…

07:03…and some of which might involve universities and various consortia.

07:06And if you solve those two problems, the next generation might be okay.

07:11If you don't solve those problems, you've got a disaster.

07:15Can I just pick up on that. I mean, in the last couple of years, we've talked about going to National Science Foundation…

07:24…and asking for research funding. And I think these last couple of years have evolved and brought into focus…

07:32…what the actual research agenda might be that we propose. And that might be a multiuniversity collaboration…

07:41…where there's a leader and there's pieces of it going on, perhaps at different scales or along different themes, but…

07:49…Tom, you want to speak to this?

07:50I think Tom's…I think your presentation at the beginning of your session was exactly correct.

07:55And the support for those kinds of structures…those have to, they have to lock, okay, but there are lots of different models.

08:02Right, but…

08:03…and I agree with that. I think the one thing I would add, and I think that would maybe appeal to NSF or to foundations…

08:10…is to take on some global challenges.

08:13So in addition to talking about the tool, and the way in which we think about design…

08:17…is to take on an issue--climate change, water scarcity, whatever--and go to a foundation and make the meeting about a topic…

08:28…using geodesign as the way to talk about it.

08:31Okay, let me throw something out and see if the group buys into this notion.

08:38The UN and our own country have made a big policy shift…I don't know if you've noticed it…in the last 18 months.

08:45This large policy shift is from trying to mitigate or change climate change processes to adaptation.

08:55Did you know this? This is radical.

08:58I went to Geneva last summer, and I was…there was a conference of maybe five or six hundred people…

09:04…they were no longer talking about stopping or…no, they were saying, Okay, how are we going to mitigate it.

09:08So the policy shift has happened. So if there was a research proposal that talked at multiple scales…

09:16…about adaptation to climate change--in short--mountains and shore…all of it…

09:27…and laid out a series of methods and responses to that…

09:30…we would get a lot of attention, I think, or you would get a lot of attention from the US federal government but also the UN…

09:37…and probably all the research domains…the National Academy, NSF, and the like.

09:42So I would say, if…Carl, if you asked me to take on number one, which is to get multiple deans here…

09:52…and Bill, we can work on this, and David, then, I would ask that you take on the leadership with respect to…

10:00…bringing a consortium together of people that would write such a series of white papers…

10:04…do the brown bags at NSF, et cetera, to do this…how many people would help Tom in doing this…

10:11…or your universities would be genuinely interested in this?

10:15[Audience question] Could you clarify though…the issue of adaptation is not in lieu of proactive [inaudible] the environment.

10:23Oh, no, no, no, no, I'm just talking about what is the subject. Okay.

10:27I want to sell this to a willing audience that has money to pay.

10:33[Audience question] Could you clarify something, though?

10:34Yeah.

10:35There's this Google existence that's indicated as far as a curriculum…there's this Google Earth…

10:42…there's these tools that are available with a different dynamic and a different business model.

10:48How do you relate to sharing the goal of geodesign with Google? To me, you have tremendous power and capability…

10:58…and awesomeness…this is my first time here…but in a sense, Google also does that, okay, and…

11:05…I would like to see the geodesign a full spectrum, to the total population, not restricted to lead what you don't control.

11:15Well, that's the case, so far.

11:16So from a dynamic standpoint, to this point, there seems to be a whole lot of control.

11:20Okay, let me go back to that in just a moment. First I want to talk about number two…

11:24…which is what are the objectives that we've got to come out of here. I don't really care what technology is used.

11:32Is a research agenda about geodesign that actually winds up in 12 or 18 months with significant funding…

11:43…to support this multiscale experiment like we did last summer or like we did last winter on the City of Redlands…

11:53…but expanded to multiple universities. That will get real attention.

12:00And Ron Abler, the person who got the National Science Foundation grant for Santa Barbara for geography…

12:07…changed the entire world of our field, pushed that for year after year with Duane Marble to get that funding.

12:16Once that funding was there, the academy changed. GIS and geography changed in the academy.

12:21So that's what I'm hunting for here with respect to linking the science and the stuff together.

12:29But don't you think that if we…I mean, as designers, we work best when there's a problem…

12:34…and to take the Redlands model but to go at a much greater scale, take on adaptation to climate change, maybe, at a reasonable scale…

12:42…and then discover what geodesign is through the thinking and working on that problem.

12:49Yeah. The third big one for me is professional ingestion, right?

13:02And for that, I think, the very first year, we had APA and ASLA here represented. They were not here, now.

13:09And I think getting to those associations as mechanisms…

13:13…to talk about both the research that you did in Redlands, for example, or the…

13:19…those of you in private practice, to share the research examples that you're carrying out…

13:25…so that other people in your professions--architecture, landscape, and planning--could see it, would be pretty amazing.

13:33With respect…

13:34Let me answer. Yeah, go ahead. I'm not the middle of the world, okay, but I have thought about the problem.

13:42The audience that's really missing is the scientists. And I'm actually…

13:48…I'd be actually quite interested to teach a bunch of scientists.

13:54I've done it, but in a collaboration. But the deans that ought to be here are not design school deans.

14:02They ought to be deans, alright, and see who comes.

14:07And the deals that have to be made are sometimes inside a university, but…

14:12…sometimes maybe it's the hydrology department. I worked with Tom Maddock in Arizona…

14:17…because my school doesn't have a hydrology department. It was terrific.

14:22So why shouldn't a science department in one school work with a design department in another school?

14:27Yeah.

14:28And so the audience, I think, has to be broadened. And by the way, let me say something else. Last thing for me.

14:35The reason I put those three scales on, and not the globe, and not the nanotechnology, is because…

14:42…the direction of education goes this way, from the sciences and the design.

14:46Those are the intersection that makes the most effective, easy collaboration…

14:52…and in my political view, the most effective change in the world. So it's not that I don't know how to do it…

15:00…and I don't, necessarily, and it's not that I'm not interested--I'm not, necessarily…

15:05…but I think I'm more interested in the scales where effective collaboration and change can be actually implemented.

15:13That's why I think you need to limit to some extent what you're going to do, or at least prioritize.

15:19But, Carl, the only way I think we're going to get other deans from the sciences here, is if there's a big pot of money…

15:25…or a big challenge that we're working on.

15:26No. They owe it, because he's been supporting them in GIS software for 15 to 20 years. That's a quid pro quo, as far as I'm concerned.

15:36Well, the International Users Conference, which is not geodesign…

15:40Okay, that could happen in the summer, by the way…

15:42It could be this summer that we try to bring them together, and David, think about this as an event, rather than here…

15:49…because there we have actually the full spectrum…

15:52It may be the right place.

15:53…and there'll be about a thousand academics there this summer.

15:56Sometimes there's deans, but often it's the department heads and practitioners.

16:00Fine, at least somebody who's alive and well.

16:03Yeah. So let us explore that. With respect to the technology, there's a thousand authors of this.

16:10It's happening in open source technology, it's happening at Google…

16:14…it's happening in Autodesk, it's happening at Bentley.

16:16This is one place it's also happening. And that's going to take on a natural life of evolution.

16:23We're interested in our own little world of getting input and criticism about the handicaps, and so are they.

16:31And they're all tool builders…and the open source community, who often leads on new initiatives…

16:39…and new research areas, is also very active in this same space.

16:44So we'll do our part, they will do their part.

16:47I don't think that it's so necessary to bring all the leaders of technology together…

16:54…in some ways, you want them competing with each other, to use all the private market mechanisms to continue going.

17:03What we do is share virtually everything that we develop here--these videos are shared…

17:09…and those of you who've been here in the past and even in this conference…

17:14…you've seen other technologies besides Esri's shown and used and pushing.

17:18So I'm interested not just in us doing this…I'm interested in promoting the industry.

17:25But I think it's an enabling part of this whole deal, it's not the fundamental driver.

17:39We have a question. Yes, right.

17:41Is this on? It's not so much a question, Jack. I've actually migrated up to being the dean level over a long period of time…

17:51My God, you're a dean?! My God.

17:53Yes. That's what I said. That's what the faculty say, too, so. But the point being that…

18:02…and I want to go back to the original GIS, the original conferences. It wasn't the deans that did this…it was faculty.

18:08This is built on interested faculty. Now I'm not saying leaders shouldn't be here…

18:13…but a lot of those leaders really don't understand what's going on.

18:19They're not going to be able to come here and put together a real white paper of what that research ought to be…

18:25…because half the time they're out trying to get money…they're in the…

18:29…the researchers are the real ground where this hits the ground.

18:32So I think the call should be to the real researchers who are interested in geodesign at any particular scale.

18:41I look at that globe, right now, and you'd mentioned earlier to me today, we were talking about climate change…

18:47…global warming, sea-level rise.

18:48There are these things that come along, that are such massive scale, that we're going to end up…

18:56…you're not going to be able to ameliorate those.

18:58There's going to be some stuff that really occurs. I come from Florida. I was going to do that…

19:03…here's a nice interesting geodesign question…and it was the sea-level rise.

19:08Use a trillion dollars' worth of property in Florida and a relatively small sea-level rise, so…

19:13…these questions, these big-picture questions and small-picture questions, if geodesign is really going to be successful…

19:20…and if Steve's future comes out, it's going to have to move across multiple scales.

19:25And I agree with Carl, the problem with education is that our silos are built to stay in scales.

19:31The professions, and the way the professions work with licensure, are built to stay in silos.

19:38And the reality of this is, we're going to either formulate a different way…

19:41…and maybe geodesign is that thing, to change the way we do business, or we're really going to have to try to figure out…

19:49…what really, what the really big problems are, and not…and if they go nonlinear on us, we're going to be in a real problem.

19:56So it's not the deans. The deans aren't the research people who drive what's going on.

20:01You can beg them for money--they may be able to give you money and that kind of stuff…

20:04…but they're not going to drive it. I think you want to get the scientists. I agree with Carl.

20:09I think the missing group here is scientists. I am a scientist, but I'm also a planner and a quasi-designer, I guess.

20:16Maybe at the Users Conference this summer, and working with our staff, now we try to bring together a consortium of…

20:22Right, I think if the Users Conference started to bring in part of this too.

20:26You've got 14,000 people who show up who really have some general kind of interest in this. That would be a really…

20:32They're all technically literate, and they're basically, they're policy people.

20:36Right.

20:38I have two last things I want to mention. The first one is, who asked about getting a job? Whether there'd be a job? Was that you?

20:48Right. That's a big agenda, and my real experience is that people actually who can come up with creative solutions…

21:01…to problems always have a job. Tim, you ever notice that? They always have a job!

21:06I'm hunting for these people every day. Once in a while they show up in my office.

21:12I try to hire them very quickly, because they solve problems…

21:16…and geo problem solving is the way that that's going to be made.

21:22Right now, it's kind of lousy, that people do do solving of problems about geography.

21:29If we can incrementally get them to solve their problems better…

21:34…using science and information and rational thinking…

21:37…and all the things that we believe in, then I think we can actually create a sustainable future.

21:43And that isn't sort of like coming from bull, that's coming from a real worry that it isn't going to work out.

21:51I mean, doesn't kind of get you once in a while, that it probably won't work out? Right now, it ain't going to work out…

21:58…unless we make some changes. So I mean, every ounce of my time…

22:03…this little ugly cloud is lurking in the back of my head, and it bothers me, a lot.

22:11And I suppose consciously or unconsciously, it's lurking in your head, isn't it?

22:16So it'd be interesting if we could simply be able to articulate what we're up to in that context.

22:24Because then I think there'll be all the jobs that we could ever imagine, if we can actually get it right.

22:36Don't worry about getting jobs, is another way to say it.

22:39That actually isn't the way the real world works. People that create and design and solve problems…

22:48…when they show up on the scene, they go right to the top.

22:53So equipping those people, billing those people--I'm with Carl…

22:57…we have to focus on, especially those of you who are educators…

23:01…building those kind of machines that come out to create the future. That's my thought.

23:07I don't really think I want to talk about anything else. I want to say thank you again.

23:10In closing, I want to thank Shannon and Bill…

23:14…and all of that geodesign team, Eric, here, personally, they've done a nice job, don't you think?

23:29And I want to thank you. Isn't it stimulating to be together? I mean, so many of you have said…

23:33…Wow, this is a very interesting conference. It isn't sort of the normal conference. That's because of you…

23:40…and your willingness and openness to share and work together and collaborate in doing that as well.

23:46So it's great. Thank you. I guess I will say, See you next year, and enjoy yourself.

23:53Stay in touch. It's been very good. Thanks. Thank you.